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Mikhailka

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2005 2:30 am    SCAM ALERT - ROGUE CASINO!!!
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PLEASE NOTE - THIS ISSUE WAS FULLY RESOLVED AND THE PLAYER GIVEN THE €200 BONUS WITHIN 24 HOURS - AFTER CC GOT IN TOUCH TO RAISE THE ISSUE

Dear site administrator, staff, and fellow members of this board,

This is a request for help and/or justice, not for myself, but made on behalf of my friend, who lives in Spain and whose English is rather rusty, and who asked me to post it here instead of him so his words don't get misunderstood. I know him for a really long time as a trustworthy person, and that's why I can personally vouch for his story (in addition to the screen shots he took, which I will also post here). In addition I've introduced my friend to casino-crush a few weeks ago, after I found it myself, and that's why I was personally involved in its latter part of the story trying to help him.

In short, we've all probably heard bad rumours about Black Widow Casino being rogue (that's why I've never personally played there). Now it seems those “rumours” XareX *MAY SEEM* completely true and Black Widow is indeed a rogue casino, currently in the business of attracting new players with a seemingly decent signup bonus, then giving them the finger. But before we say anything else and throw empty accusations around (didn't you just do that? lol), let's review their terms and conditions for this bonus, shall we?

*edits by crushadmin for fairness*

Quote:
This special offer is only available to NEW Black Widow members who have been referred from specific RichWebmaster affiliate campaign IDs for a very limited time. Get a 400% initial deposit bonus now! Download and play today! This offer will end Wednesday, November, 30th, 11:59:59 p.m, EST*.

How do I receive this special 400% bonus?

Deposit Bonus
$50 $200


Make an initial deposit of $50.
Complete your deposit-playthrough of 4 times rollover to receive the bonus.
The bonus will be added automatically into your account balance within the hour after the wager requirements have been fulfilled.
To cash out, complete your bonus-playthrough requirements of 25 times rollover.
*Note: Only wagering made on non-restricted games will be eligible to satisfy the wagering requirements of this offer. Please read all the terms, to learn of your playthrough requirements.

Terms:

IMPORTANT: This offer is ONLY open to first time depositors.
All forms of Baccarat, all arcade games, all forms of Blackjack, Craps, American Roulette/RoulettePro and Sic Bo are excluded from playthrough qualification for this promotion.
When playing Slots, Video Poker or any other non-restricted game to satisfy the wagering requirements, players must wager their deposit 4 times (UK/GBP players 7 time deposit play through) to receive the bonus, and 25 times to cash-out any portion of the bonus.
Please note that bonus play through tracking will not begin until your bonus has been deposited to your account.
This bonus is subject to our official Terms and Conditions, which shall be binding in all cases. You must comply at all times with the standards and/or laws in any jurisdiction where you are located or residing.
No cash-ins for less than the bonus amount received - after completing wagering requirements for a given bonus - will be honoured. The withdrawal amount will be returned to the player's account, and should this occur again, the casino reserves the right to close a player's account.
Players making a withdrawal before their wagering requirements have been completed will be advised that their bonus will be automatically removed from their account balance and given a chance to cancel that withdrawal. If the withdrawal is filed, the bonus amount removed WILL NOT BE REISSUED.
First time depositors that attempt to cash in their real money balance BEFORE they receive their welcome bonus will have their withdrawal declined and the amount deposited back to their player account. Further attempts to do this will lead to account closure.
Attempts to layer this bonus with further bonuses, or any other effort to play not for entertainment but for pure financial gain, may result in the return of your deposit, the loss of all bonus money, and any future opportunities to earn bonuses at Black Widow Casino
By accepting and gambling using this promotion, the player indicates that these rules have been read and agreed to.
Black Widow Casino reserves the right to terminate this offer at anytime during the promotion without advance notice.
You are allowed ONLY ONE ACTIVE ACCOUNT. Winnings will only be dispersed to players having ONE account. If you have more than one account, all winnings will be VOID.
If the name on your casino account does NOT match the name on the NETeller, PPATM, Moneybookers, INSTADEBIT, Firepay, Visa or MasterCard account used to make deposits to the account, any winnings in that account will be VOID. For security reasons, you have been issued a log-on password. In the event that you lose or forget this password, it may be retrieved from our database. If any of the above applies to you, or you have any questions regarding our policies, contact our 24 HR Customer Service Department for assistance. All cash-ins will be subject to audit before being processed. Black Widow Casino reserves all rights to reclaim bonuses or any winnings for failed audits. Black Widow Casino reserves the right to modify these rules or cancel this promotion at its discretion. Black Widow Casino reserves the right to close accounts at any time especially when registration information is discovered to be incorrect or misleading. Black Widow Casino is restricted to individuals of legal age only. Minors may not play. All promotions are available only once per person, family, household address, e-mail address, credit card number, and environments where computers are shared (university, fraternity, school, public library, workplace, etc). This promotional may only be used in combination with the NETeller or Moneybookers offer at Black Widow Casino. By accepting and gambling using this promotion, the player indicates that these rules have been read and agreed to.
Individuals residing in the countries of China, India, Sweden, Poland, Malaysia and Denmark will not be eligible for this promotion.
*Management has the right to extend or discontinue this special bonus offer at any time.


So my Spanish friend saw this 400% exclusive to casino-crush.com bonus, followed the ***exact banner link from this site*** to Black Widow Casino (I figure this is important to mention) today, downloaded the casino, registered an account, and made a deposit of 50 Euro. Then he proceeded to play Casino War with 5 Euro a hand, and busted out before he got to wager even 150 Euro (which is pretty weird in itself with ~98% average return on War in Playtech casinos – maybe Black Widow's software is rigged too?!). Now, the terms and conditions say he has to wager his deposit 4x to receive the bonus, which obviously didn't happen since he depleted his balance, while playing with his own money. At this stage he came to me for help because of his poor knowledge of English and unfamiliarity of the situation, and I obviously didn't turn down his request.

That's where the interesting things started happening – he told me there's no mention at all in the terms and conditions as to what would happen if the player loses his deposit before qualifying. So I've personally FULLY read the terms and conditions over a few times, thinking that maybe he just didn't understand them. Nope, he was right, there's nothing relating to that here. But at least it said he should get his bonus credited within an hour, and that's good, right...? ...well, sometime later he messages me and says he only got 50 Euro credited to his account.“Never fear”, said I, “just talk to their 'immediate and helpful support' (their words, not mine, support section of the site), they'll surely be able to help you. I'll even translate on MSN if you don't understand something the 'experienced and informed M2S2 agents' (their words again, which makes it all rather ironic) tell you. It'll all be fine.”. Boy, was I wrong...

For starters the customer support rep in question, “Angie”, wasn't familiar with this 400% bonus. She didn't seem to be all that informed, trying to give him the 10% cashback bonus (which is idiotic in itself, since as a customer support agents she SHOULD know all the different promotions running at the same time, not like that have thousands of them). He gave her the direct link to this promotion, which she was studying for a few minutes. Then she proceeded to tell him that the maximum bonus he can get is 50 Euro which **SHE THINKS*** was already credited (out of nowhere and randomly, considering she just read the promotional terms and conditions for 200 Euro bonus, advertised here, in this thread...).

From there on he insisted it's supposed to be 200 as advertised, while she insisted he only gets 50 Euro (which he has never explicitly accepted as you can see from the chat screen captures, it was credited to him automatically by their system). I even suggested him to ask if he can make another deposit and finish the remaining wagering requirements (somewhere around 60 Euro) to get the full bonus, to which she flatly said no. So I told him to make screenshots of the chat conversation, which he did, and to not touch the 50 Euro she credited to his account, which he also did, and exit the casino. And that's where it leaves us now... He fully lost his 50 Euro deposit, still has only 50 Euro bonus on his account, and the experienced, informed and helpful casino customer support refuses to cooperate.



(edited by crushadmin - some of this went a bit too far without proof of foul play - the terms were not met by the player so the comments from here-on were considered 'unfair') This post will be forwarded to our affiliate manager ASAP for his feedback once the we have received the player id.


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Mikhailka

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2005 2:34 am    -
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And here are the saved conversation screens....

(these screenshots have now been removed - the basic thing was the customer support rep did not know about the 400% bonus offer). This mis-communication is now being resolved so all agents are aware of it. Of course - if anyone has any further difficulties claiming the bonus (which is in fact automatic after a 4 x play through of the deposit amount) - then please PM me (crushadmin) with your account id (only if you signed up via a CC banner of course - otherwise there's nothing we can do).

My friend and I will be reading this thread, if you'll have any questions (and if anyone from cc staff who can help needs his player id), and I'll keep it updated as to where the situation is heading, if there will be any changes, that is.


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crushadmin

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2005 2:56 am    -
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Dearest Mikhailka,

Thank you for your impartial concern raised here. Normally we don't allow posting of 'complaints' - but do have a more discreet complaints process so we can check all the facts before we expose any casino if we believe them to be guilty of foul-play.

Anyway, from looking at what you've posted, it would seem that your friend did not meet the following term in order to claim the bonus:-

Quote:
Complete your deposit-playthrough of 4 times rollover to receive the bonus.


We don't have any evidence to show that the software is 'rigged' as you put it - the Playtech software, play and randomness are centrally controlled by Playtech - not by the casino operator. As such Black Widow are not physically able to 'rig' their software. We don't believe this to be the case of any Playtech software casino from past experience.

I do, however sympathise and would appreciate you giving me the players' account id via PM (Private Message) to me , crushadmin and I will forward this to our affiliate manager and see if we can get some sort of comp applied to his account.

That is, I'm afraid the best I can do in this case because on the players own admission - they have not met the terms of the bonus qualification.

I hope you see our point of view on this, and whilst I'm sure it will give some disappointment, hopefully we can do something about this if you can give me your friends account id (via PM please).

Best regards and Happy Gaming Always,

Geno/CC


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Mikhailka

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2005 3:17 am    -
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Dear admin,

Thanks for your quick reply. I've left an e-mail for my friend, so he should send me his player id when he wakes up, and I will forward it to you.


I just have one comment to make, in regards to --

« crushadmin » wrote:
Dearest Mikhailka,

Anyway, from looking at what you've posted, it would seem that your friend did not meet the following term in order to claim the bonus:-

Quote:
Complete your deposit-playthrough of 4 times rollover to receive the bonus.

...

That is, I'm afraid the best I can do in this case because on the players own admission - they have not met the terms of the bonus qualification.



As you can see from the chat screens he offered to add more of his own money to the account and complete the wagering requirements in order to qualify for the bonus, which the customer rep said wouldn't do him any good. So it's the casino that wouldn't allow him to complete the wagering requirements due to a very advantageous for them gray area in their promotional terms (no information as to what should be done if the deposit is lost in full), not him not wanting to complete them (he only has around 60 euro left to wager out of the 200...)...

Also we both didn't understand where it says that he will get only 50 Euro bonus if he loses the deposit (not 200) in promotional terms and conditions, as fully posted here.... Nothing like that exists in promo terms... In reality he wasn't supposed to get a bonus at all since he didn't qualify for it, but they just gave him 50 Euro... Hope you see what I'm getting at... He signed up for the advertised 400% and they're trying to get him to accept those 50 Euro, which he had no clue about and are not mentioned on the page through which he got the software, and that's the bottomline.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2005 6:29 pm    -
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Dear Mikhailka, and friend,

Please note that having discussed this with our affiliate manager I'm pleased to inform you that the €200 euro bonus has now been applied to your friends' account at Black Widow Casino.

There were two reasons for the bonus not being credited in the first place:-

1) Your friend did not wager his deposit 4x before reaching a zero balance (in which case it would have been credited automatically)
2) The customer support agent he dealt with was unaware of this special promo which is only available to a select few affiliates. This however has been highlighted and they should all now be aware.

I understand that our manager is now watching all accounts to ensure that any due bonuses are credited quickly.

Of course if anyone gets any issues - please PM me - and I'm sure like this one - we will have it sorted asap Smile

Best regards and Happy Gaming Always,

Geno/CC


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2005 2:29 pm    -
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Hello Everyone,

My name is Rick Parks and I am the affiliate manager for RichWebmaster affiliates and we are responsible for promoting Black Widow (as well as other casinos). I am sorry for not replying earlier.

CC told me there was a player who did not get the special bonus offer we had arranged with CC for this week. I am not sure what I can add to CC's last post, to be honest. He explained this rather well.

What happened was our Spanish friend did not wager the required 4 times his deposit to receive the 400% welcome bonus. When the deposit was lost the system went looking for a bonus that he had qualified for; the 100%/50 for 50 bonus. The system is good but it is very difficult to teach it any customer satisfaction skills wink.

The 400% bonus (see above) is a special one we had just set up qith CC and the customer service agent was not yet familiar with it. There are literally thousands of bonuses but usually only about 20 to keep track of at any given time. We have made doubly sure every agent is aware of this bonus now.

I apologise to Mikhailka and his freind for the delay in getting the 400% welcome bonus available only through the above link and for a limited time only (so get clicking and playing).

There are reasons for a wagering requirement for the deposit and for why we don't mention in the T&C's what happens when a player loses a deposit before getting a bonus but I have taken too much space here as it is but I will reply if someone is really interested.

I would like to thank everyone (specially CC) and I encourage everyone to click the Black Widow banner (above) and get playing. It is a great way to try out a new casino.

Cheers,


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2005 5:17 am    I am also having problems with this casino offer...
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I signed up with BlackWidowCasino last month to take advantage of this offer as well. I played for a while and ended up winning several hundred dollars. On November 26th, after verifing with casino support that I had met all requirements and terms, I made a withdrawal request . I received a verification email that day and within a few days I also received a phone call from someone with the casino who assured me there was no problem with withdrawal and that they were just verifying my information.
Although the site specifies a delay of 7-10 business days for a withdrawal, after about 8 days I contacted customer support and was assured it would be processed by the tenth day. However after the 10th day had passed and I had not paid, I contacted customer support by phone again. They apologized and said that they were unable to contact the department that handled financial transactions at that time as that department was closed. They told me that if I called back during their business hours they could try to assist me further. They also told me that they would send an email to the department for me to regarding the withdrawal, and told me that someone would contact me by phone or email soon. I waited a few more days and had still not been paid or even contacted so I called again within the hours specified. However, this time I was told that due to the way their departments were set up, the ONLY way anyone including themselves could contact someone within the financial department was by email. I told them I had been told an email was sent several days earlier and that no one had responded. They apologized and said they would send another email for me. I also got the addresses they were sending emails to and wrote an email to them as well. At this point I had been waiting about 14 business days.
Several more days passed and Istill had not received any form of communication and I called again. I was told the same thing as the previous times and was told again that an email would be sent to the relevant departments for me. I was assured that if they sent an email immediately, which they said they would, I should receive a response within 2 hours. I also sent an email to the addresses specifed again, one of which was to the casino admin, the other to Central Deposit (the company that apprently handles the financial transactions for the casino). However, again I received no response from either email or from customer support.
At this point I have been waiting well over a month for this withdrawal to be processed and I have not received ANY communication from the casino or central deposit as to why there has been such a delay. I have contacted the support department atleast 8 times and sent atleast 2 more emails, the most recent being sent Wednesday of this week. I have become extremely concerned as to why I have not received atleast some sort of contact and I am also very worried as the withdrawal is so old that I will not be able to even check the status of the pending withdrawal within the casino after tomorrow. The most upsetting part of this is that since the site stated a 7-10 payment period, I had been counting on the extra money to buy some additional Christmas presents. That is obviously not a possibilty now, but I hope that since the previous person got help with their problem so quickly and support is unable to give any additionaly assistance, someone who can help me might see my post here and assist me too. I can provide my account number upon request if someone with the casino could contact me.
Thank You,
Matt B.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2005 7:19 pm    -
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HI Matt, I've directed this to Gene for you and he will get on this the first business day into the new year as most offices will not be closed for New Years.

DrCrush


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2005 7:31 pm    -
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Matt, please PM (private message) me with your account id Smile

Many thanks
Geno/CC


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2005 10:54 pm    Id forwarded
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Thanks to the admins for responding so quickly. I want to to also note that I had chosen Neteller for the withdrawal type, so this is another reason I am concerned at how long it has taken. I have forwarded my id and hope things will be resolved soon.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2006 9:42 pm    -
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Checking in again... I'm wondering if there is some news about this situation? I sent the account id to geno Saturday and it's Tuesday now. I still haven't received payment or any contact from the casino or the admins since the last post. Did you atleast get the account number I pm'd to you? Again I appreciate any help you can provide.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2006 11:11 am    Thank you
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I would like to post that this issue has finally been resolved. I finally received contact from the company on the 3rd and was paid on Jan 6th. I would like to thank Geno and the other admins for anything they may have had to do with this. Very Happy


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